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The 'producing Beats/music Thread'

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#21
Jimmy Rabbitte

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A long time ago I got into turntablism and bought some decks. My best friend is also into it but to a higher degree, he's got tons of studio equipment and software, and has made lots of hella dope beats. A few years ago, my needles broke and I was broke and out of work, couldn't buy records or needles or recording hardware & software, plus I was focused on other things. He's pushing me to keep going, though. I'm working again and I just bought some new needles, got some battle records, and I have a song that I want to sample really bad. It's funny that I just saw this, because I was about to set up the mbox he gave me today.
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#22
j type

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QUOTE (Jimmy Rabbitte @ Aug 2 2009, 08:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
A long time ago I got into turntablism and bought some decks. My best friend is also into it but to a higher degree, he's got tons of studio equipment and software, and has made lots of hella dope beats. A few years ago, my needles broke and I was broke and out of work, couldn't buy records or needles or recording hardware & software, plus I was focused on other things. He's pushing me to keep going, though. I'm working again and I just bought some new needles, got some battle records, and I have a song that I want to sample really bad. It's funny that I just saw this, because I was about to set up the mbox he gave me today.


What setup you got man (needles, decks, battle records, etc.)?

I used to be heavily into turntablism and used to battle a bit, but then I got more into the production side of things and don't practice as often.

#23
Jimmy Rabbitte

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Numark 200s.. Numark DM1050 or something mixer, used to have shure needles now numarks.. numark sucks a fat one but when I got them I was a kid, I bought it with bday and christmas money.. if/when I get into this more heavily I will get some vestax or techs.. oh yeah I have the straight needle arms.. garbage

I only just recently started picking up battle records, got Roulette 1 and 3, that video game break record (stupid purchase) and some unnamed break records I don't even remember where they came from.. early on I was more concerned with finding samples than battle sounds because of my lame needle setup, so I mostly got a bunch of jazz, funk, disco.. and random odds and ends. just 2 cratefuls though.
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#24
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QUOTE (Jimmy Rabbitte @ Aug 2 2009, 08:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Numark DM1050 or something mixer,


I think that was my first mixer actually. Do you have the chrome one or the blue one?

QUOTE (Jimmy Rabbitte @ Aug 2 2009, 08:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
oh yeah I have the straight needle arms.. garbage


Well, I don't know about that particular deck, but straight arms are supposed to have better tracking for scratching.


QUOTE (Jimmy Rabbitte @ Aug 2 2009, 08:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
that video game break record (stupid purchase) and some unnamed break records I don't even remember where they came from..


Lol! Yeah man, I know all about stupid battle break record purchases. icon_razz.gif Some of them I only bought for one particular scratch sound, less than a second long, while the rest of the record is just nonsense.


QUOTE (Jimmy Rabbitte @ Aug 2 2009, 08:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
used to have shure needles now numarks..




That's what I use. I love those needles man. icon_smile.gif


#25
Jimmy Rabbitte

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I got the chrome mixer.

Straight needle arms tend to jump if you're pulling a lot of torque. Even with the counterweight really close in. I'm pretty heavy handed, of course I hardly ever practiced.. but the bent arms follow the groove of the record and like to stay in place even when you're spinning like crazy.

It's amazing how long it took me to buy Roulette, it's such a great record. All of the best sounds and really high fidelity.
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#26
j type

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QUOTE (Jimmy Rabbitte @ Aug 2 2009, 08:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I got the chrome mixer.


Yeah, that's the one I got too. I'm sure I've still got it laying around in a cupboard somewhere.


QUOTE (Jimmy Rabbitte @ Aug 2 2009, 08:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It's amazing how long it took me to buy Roulette, it's such a great record. All of the best sounds and really high fidelity.


Yeah? I don't know that one tbh. Is it more scratch sounds or breaks?

#27
Jimmy Rabbitte

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The first one has a couple breaks but it's mostly scratch sounds. It's got a lot of the standard old school hip-hop sounds and a few obscure sounds.

The second one is more or less the same, I didn't pick it up, my friend said he heard it wasn't that good.

The third one's a double LP of breaks, it's set up for beat juggling. I haven't looked at it yet because the headshell on one of my decks vanished
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#28
j type

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Oh ok, fair enough. Do you do much beat-juggling yourself? Or more scratching?

#29
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Back when I cared, and now recently, I've mostly just been scratching. What got me into it was Q-Bert and MMM creating these outlandish sounds. I'm into experimental stuff like Aphex twin, dig some noise, love space rock, so what I wanted to do in terms of my own music was pursue that route. Don't get me wrong, I like traditional hip-hop, and I plan on making some beats our homies can spit over, but I want to make mostly instrumental tracks.

Beat juggling is hard. Lol. I haven't got good at it yet.. what trips me up is the timing, getting the next record cued up in the right spot, etc. Plan on practicing more when I get that headshell..
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#30
Jamie

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Rather scary that you guys have all been doing this for so long, and I can't even master the basics of FL lol. Just goes to show, theres wayyy to many people in this game.
QUOTE (Tree_ @ May 20 2009, 10:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Jamie, just go smoke some crack; you'll feel better.


#31
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QUOTE (Jamie @ Aug 2 2009, 02:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Rather scary that you guys have all been doing this for so long, and I can't even master the basics of FL lol. Just goes to show, theres wayyy to many people in this game.


Yeah.. turntablism had a few bouts of mainstream attention.. I'm kind of mad about the CD turntables and that fucking video game.. accessibility is nice but there's too many scrubs who think they're good because they can make a loop and do a little scratch w/o using the fader. I'm hatin'...

You can make beats for rappers, you can play your live sets.. but if you want to be good, do your own thing. I'm not saying you can't look to other djs for ideas or do any of that other stuff, but try to come up with an original sound. DJs are a dime a dozen.. so are guitarists, drummers, singers, rappers.. that's how the game is. The cream of the crop are the ones that do something new, there's not a lot of that going on nowadays, like Aphex Twin said, too many sheep, not enough shephards.
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#32
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Yes, there really are a lot of people trying to 'make it' in music production, but the good news is - noobs tend to follow other noobs. So if you want to stand out from the crowd, it's really not that complicated.

As Jimmy said, just focus on developing your own style and not copying others. That's great advice and is always worth keeping in mind. I've heard it said so many thousands of times by so many thousands of producers and musicians and artists, that it's become a bit of a cliché. It shouldn't be treated as such, however. Good advice is good advice, no matter how many times it's offered. (:

The technical skills will come in time. Those can be taught and learned easily. But originality, style and a good ear - they have to be constantly worked on and it's those things that will set you apart.

Edited by j type, 02 August 2009 - 06:17 PM.


#33
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Originality is a rare thing, what inspires you guys? Just listening to stuff thats been made?
QUOTE (Tree_ @ May 20 2009, 10:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Jamie, just go smoke some crack; you'll feel better.


#34
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ableton is made of god juice

ive got some new mixes coming out very very very soon. im on vacation so i dont have access to the finalizing tools i use, but the main mp3 is done. look for the first one on the 5th and the second one later in the month (i want to space out releases).

my best advice is this: dont make something you dont want to listen to in your own free time. if its something where as soon as its done you go listen to other stuff, then it was clearly not a very good track...that or you over worked it and youve burned out on the track (which is also no good).

heres a link to my already released stuff....

http://forums.purepw...showtopic=84393

most people tend to download the first one because...well its the first one. but honestly, i would jump to the newer mixes as they are definitely better...of course, you also need to be concerned about styles of music as well. for example, D and I are totally different from the rest. K is also very unique.

Edited by Rakielis, 03 August 2009 - 03:22 PM.


#35
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QUOTE (Jamie @ Aug 3 2009, 11:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Originality is a rare thing, what inspires you guys? Just listening to stuff thats been made?

getting stoned and watching/reading sci-fi
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#36
Majiffy The Magic Admin

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QUOTE (j type @ Aug 2 2009, 03:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
But soft synths are only a fraction of what MIDI is about. And it's not just limited to that. If you're saying that you don't like the sound of most synthesized music, then that's a different issue entirely.

As far as MIDI is concerned, if you don't add in controllers and using it to perform your usual DAW functions that you can do just as well with a keyboard and a mouse, soft synth is the main use. And this is what I object to; it fucking sucks.

QUOTE (j type @ Aug 2 2009, 03:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well, are you referring to actual soft synths? Or instrument emulators? Or giga samplers? If you are looking to soft synths for instrument emulation, then you're pretty much looking in the wrong place and it's no surprise that you haven't found any that sound 'decent'.

Actual soft synths. If I was talking about emulators or samplers, I would say that.

QUOTE (j type @ Aug 2 2009, 03:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
In my experience, there are several instruments that can very well be recreated digitally anyway, either via synthesis or sampling. Pianos, drums, harps and most percussive instruments are a good example of this. Of course, stringed instruments do present more of a challenge, but can still sound very convincing.

There are a lot of great old synths that have been recreated, I've downloaded a few Moog ones from their early days. They're great. Strings are interesting but I've got a few techniques to making them sound amazing.

QUOTE (j type @ Aug 2 2009, 03:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Lol! You assume that I don't play any instruments, when I actually do. I play several. So don't try to turn that into an underhanded criticism of the genres that I like working in, nor the level of effort that you think goes into my music.

The way you phrased that sentence made it sound like you do little more than production. I haven't heard your music, so why would I be insulting how much work goes into it? That'd be silly.

QUOTE (j type @ Aug 2 2009, 03:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Your statement that "MIDI has made music progressively worse", is not only wrong, but displays a very narrow-minded opinion and outlook on music.

Have you listened to the majority of pop music that's being put out lately? It's almost entirely MIDI dependent because a lot of the top producers just aren't making the money and thus not spending the money that they used to. And quite frankly, it's gone downhill; a lot. Denying this is only denying your own ignorance.

QUOTE (j type @ Aug 2 2009, 03:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Actually your comments are starting to reveal a certain snobbery towards electronic music as a whole, which, among other things, has no place in this thread (see title).

Obviously, you're a complete moron. The majority of my music career has been in electronic music, and I'm a huge fan of it. I suggest you stop trying to read into what I say so much. What I say is intended as I say it, there's nothing underlying beneath it.

QUOTE (j type @ Aug 2 2009, 03:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So, what, MIDI requires no understanding of what you're doing?

I've seen kids with no prior musical experience make more or less equivalent beats to radio friendly hip hop in about 2 minutes on a simple MIDI drum sampler. And after seeing some videos of hip hop producers, I've come to realize they don't seem to do much more than that. So yes.

QUOTE (j type @ Aug 2 2009, 03:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So is the issue is that you can't be bothered to learn and put the effort into using soft synths or giga samplers?

No no no, I've learned them. I just think that they're (soft synths, not samplers) absolutely dreadful compared to the other things you can do with sound...


#37
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QUOTE (j type @ Aug 2 2009, 03:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Actually your comments are starting to reveal a certain snobbery towards electronic music as a whole, which, among other things, has no place in this thread (see title).


this could have been phrased better...

QUOTE (Majiffy The Magic Admin @ Aug 4 2009, 05:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Obviously, you're a complete moron. The majority of my music career has been in electronic music, and I'm a huge fan of it. I suggest you stop trying to read into what I say so much. What I say is intended as I say it, there's nothing underlying beneath it.


but this was totally unnecessary. we dont care if the majority of your career is in EDM and we dont care if you are a huge fan of it; that doesnt give you the right to call him a moron. so how bout you dont flame people and this whole thread will go a lot smoother...or you can choose to keep acting this way and we can have a problem. ill let you decide.

jtype, please be mature and help me out by not replying to that particular part of his post.

#38
Majiffy The Magic Admin

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Raised warn level for flaming another user after being verbally warned. -Rakielis

Edited by Rakielis, 05 August 2009 - 02:19 PM.


#39
j type

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OK, well our discussion hasn't got us anywhere further than when we started really, so I think the debate on MIDI should probably end for now.

Just one or two things first though (I couldn't resist icon_wink.gif ):

QUOTE (Majiffy The Magic Admin @ Aug 4 2009, 10:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Have you listened to the majority of pop music that's being put out lately? It's almost entirely MIDI dependent because a lot of the top producers just aren't making the money and thus not spending the money that they used to. And quite frankly, it's gone downhill; a lot. Denying this is only denying your own ignorance.


Why would I want to factor in Pop music? Pop music has never been a good representation of the quality of music available to the discerning listener and it never will be.

However, despite that being the case, I still can't bring myself to agree with you that it's actually been made worse by the advent of MIDI. I can see this getting dangerously close to becoming a "what is art?"-type debate, which I'm not interested in pursuing right now, but I don't think that you can definitively say that music is 'worse' now, pop or otherwise. You may like it less, but that's a different issue entirely.

Semantics aside, I do agree that there is a lot of rubbish out there, which has obviously been pieced together with whatever preset sounds and patches came packaged with Pro Tools by kids who don't know/care much at all about music. I will also concede that MIDI and the advancements in digital music technology have allowed for this.


QUOTE (Majiffy The Magic Admin @ Aug 4 2009, 10:19 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
No no no, I've learned them. I just think that they're (soft synths, not samplers) absolutely dreadful compared to the other things you can do with sound...


This is very much an issue of taste and obviously an opinion. An opinion which, I must admit, I do not share.

Edited by j type, 04 August 2009 - 02:41 PM.


#40
Majiffy The Magic Admin

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QUOTE (j type @ Aug 4 2009, 03:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why would I want to factor in Pop music? Pop music has never been a good representation of the quality of music available to the discerning listener and it never will be.

However, despite that being the case, I still can't bring myself to agree with you that it's actually been made worse by the advent of MIDI. I can see this getting dangerously close to becoming a "what is art?"-type debate, which I'm not interested in pursuing right now, but I don't think that you can definitively say that music is 'worse' now, pop or otherwise. You may like it less, but that's a different issue entirely.

Semantics aside, I do agree that there is a lot of rubbish out there, which has obviously been pieced together with whatever preset sounds and patches came packaged with Pro Tools by kids who don't know/care much at all about music. I will also concede that MIDI and the advancements in digital music technology have allowed for this.

As much as I'd love to not factor in pop music, you can't deny that the direction of pop music is ultimately the direction of the very large majority of music; so as it declines, music in general will decline. I'm not saying there aren't great things going on out there, I'm just saying the majority of it has done nothing but degrade itself.

QUOTE (j type @ Aug 4 2009, 03:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
This is very much an issue of taste and obviously an opinion. An opinion which, I must admit, I do not share.

Honestly, this could have ended the whole discussion from the beginning, as my original comment was how much I hate MIDI and think it's dreadful. I never said this was concrete fact for everyone, this is my personal opinion.




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