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Punk versus "Punk"

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#1
nigy

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So this might end up with me getting a schoolin' lesson in genres but here goes:

I have seen the bands Bad Religion and Social Distortion catagorized as "punk".

I have also seen bands like the Misfits, Black Flag, Minor Threat, etc, called "punk"

This slightly confuses me, because the sound of Minor Threat is much different than Bad Religion. Would you ascribe sub-genres to these two "groups" ?

ALSO:

Me, being a fan of Bad religion/social distortion, but not a fan at all of the sound of Minor Threat (possible exceptions exist i guess, like Op Ivy and Rancid), ....Can anyone recommend bands similar to Bad Religion and/or Social Distortion?


thanks icon_smile.gif <3


#2
MCClammer

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Punk is a bit about a sound, but punk, like indie in a sense is about an attitude, label and the character/integrity of a band. Why people hate bands being called punk that they don't think are punk is because they view the band as fake and without 'punk' integrity. Usually the lyrics are political. This is how people in my local punk scenes and my friends and I view it.
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#3
nigy

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QUOTE (MCClammer @ Mar 10 2008, 08:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Punk is a bit about a sound, but punk, like indie in a sense is about an attitude, label and the character/integrity of a band. Why people hate bands being called punk that they don't think are punk is because they view the band as fake and without 'punk' integrity. Usually the lyrics are political. This is how people in my local punk scenes and my friends and I view it.



I agree with you here. My problem is if both of the groups of bands i listed get called "punk" then its hard to find "more of the same" of one or the other, because its such a broad adjective.

#4
MCClammer

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I gotta go but there definitely are a ridiculous amount of subgenres of punk. Like Oi, skinhead, post punk, anarcho-punk, garage, ska, minimalist. I have a friend I should ask. He knows far more than I do, he loves punk, I love punk too but I am more in love with learning about all different types of music.
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#5
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QUOTE (MCClammer @ Mar 10 2008, 10:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I gotta go but there definitely are a ridiculous amount of subgenres of punk. Like Oi, skinhead, post punk, anarcho-punk, garage, ska, minimalist. I have a friend I should ask. He knows far more than I do, he loves punk, I love punk too but I am more in love with learning about all different types of music.


Ska came WAY before punk did.

#6
MCClammer

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QUOTE (zeos @ Mar 10 2008, 09:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Ska came WAY before punk did.

Yes, yes it did, but then punk bands liked ska and played a mixture of both, playing ska punk.. so yes, yes it is a subgenre.
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#7
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Punk - Someone who gives or receives sodomy in prison.




look it up folks



that being said, Punk has all but died in the grand sense. Their are still true punk bands, but they are nothing like the Psudo Punk or "pop punk" shit they play on the radio.

MSI.... now that's a true Punk band.

Blink 182, should burn in hell.....





and Ska.... kicks ass....

#8
Matas

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Listen to the Dead Kennedys if you don't know them... but you should!

I'm actually not a huge fan of Social D... they're a bit too country for me hahaha
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#9
TheCh*ckenFace

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You're doing it wrong! Punk isn't about the sound! Its about what the music is directed towards and the feeling.

Compare two of the truest punk bands out there: The Ramones and The Clash - these bands certainly don't sound anything like each other but both are undeniably punk. Must say the Ramones weren't actually the truest punks, but punk none the less.

There is a lot of gray area in what is punk and what isn't. Attempting to define the sound will most likely me met with hostility as my comments above likely will be to some people.

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#10
MCClammer

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A lot people would argue that the Clash sold out but I still think their impact on the genre overshadows any possible "selling out" on their part. The Dead Kennedys sold out without Jello though, he was the back bone and band.
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#11
TheCh*ckenFace

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QUOTE (MCClammer @ Mar 11 2008, 10:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
A lot people would argue that the Clash sold out but I still think their impact on the genre overshadows any possible "selling out" on their part. The Dead Kennedys sold out without Jello though, he was the back bone and band.

Yep, people sure say that, but I'm sure The Clash never intentionally wanted it to seem that way, and it just doesn't seem them at heart; they were just so damn badass! lol
If any punk band came close to selling out, and obviously many have, The Ramones would be slightly guilty there, but they've regained their integrity. Perhaps pop punk is the the real faker here- the name says it all. Yea ... Green Day.... I went there icon_surprised.gif

Respect to the OP for appreciating Rancid, Op Ivy and Bad Religion; never met anybody in RL that has even heard of those bands!... only similar band that springs to mind in that vein is the Dead Kennedy's but you've obviously heard them, right?

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#12
nigy

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QUOTE (TheCh*ckenFace @ Mar 11 2008, 04:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
YYea ... Green Day.... I went there icon_surprised.gif


I really can't say that Green Day sold out. I can't dislike a band for wanting to get big, and i can only say kudos for them for making it as big as they did. They grew up, changed their sound, and made a lot more money. No one should be expected to write fast lyrics about sticking it the man for their whole career. </defending green day>

And yes Ive heard the dead kennedy's, and perhaps I should listen to them some more. I find that in many cases I enjoy the third listen through of an album more than the previous two.


#13
MCClammer

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I won't lie, I got into the dead kennedys late(well considering I usually go to the roots of genre first to explore it) and through a sellout cd, Live: At the Deaf Club.. I still like it, I am a sucker for live albums.
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#14
TheCh*ckenFace

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QUOTE (nigy @ Mar 11 2008, 11:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I really can't say that Green Day sold out. I can't dislike a band for wanting to get big, and i can only say kudos for them for making it as big as they did. They grew up, changed their sound, and made a lot more money. No one should be expected to write fast lyrics about sticking it the man for their whole career. </defending green day>

And yes Ive heard the dead kennedy's, and perhaps I should listen to them some more. I find that in many cases I enjoy the third listen through of an album more than the previous two.



Entire post damn right.

Also, maybe being a bit harsh on the guys, but their new sound get boring so quickly, then again I've grown a little tired of much punk music icon_sad.gif

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#15
Sex Pistol

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The first set of bands have a Punk Rock sound.

The second set are Hardcore Punk.

There's also the first wave of Punk, but that kind of sound would be more described as pop punk, like The McRackins. Not all pop punk is like that, though. I'm just saying that's what people would call it if someone were to make it in modern times.

#16
Matas

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Rancid aren't what they used to be... I lost a bit of respect for them after their release of the ''Fall Back Down'' video; ''what in the name of shit'' was that? Lol. Including Good Charlotte people and miny Osbourne in it? Pfff....

Rancid were great. Perhaps their music hasn't drastically changed but it seems like their attitude has somewhat.
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#17
nigy

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QUOTE (Matas @ Mar 11 2008, 08:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Rancid aren't what they used to be... I lost a bit of respect for them after their release of the ''Fall Back Down'' video; ''what in the name of shit'' was that? Lol. Including Good Charlotte people and miny Osbourne in it? Pfff....

Rancid were great. Perhaps their music hasn't drastically changed but it seems like their attitude has somewhat.


I can talk about Rancid similarly as I did about Green Day. I very much enjoy two Rancid Albums, ...And out come the Wolves, and Indestructible, even though the latter is much more pop-ey and the former much less so. (Interestingly, I am not much of a fan of both of Rancid's self-titled albums...)

#18
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Did somebody mention...Daft Punk? Yeah, DP pwn totally.

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#19
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QUOTE (Tjharwin @ Mar 12 2008, 03:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Did somebody mention...Daft Punk? Yeah, DP pwn totally.

Your gay.

#20
Matas

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Haha... about Daft Punk. A few years ago my friend told me he liked Daft Punk, I said they were ok, and asked what was the reason for having 'Punk' in the band name. Then he answered me 100% serious that ''the definition of techno is that it's crazy punk''; those were his exact 100% serious words... hahahahahahahaha

Oh and my favourite Rancid albums are probably And Out Come the Wolves, Life Wont Wait and Rancid 2000 (2nd self-titled). Indestructible being my least liked... heh
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