1712 replies to this topic

[frostyx]

I think what Base was getting at, was that Republicans are generally pro-Iraq War. That war has caused our government to accumulate a debt of trillions of dollars. I dont like higher taxes any more than anyone else, but unfortunately we're going to need higher taxes in order to pay it all off.

[pickupstix60]

Obama ftw. He's probably going to win the GE.

McCain wouldn't be so bad if he weren't so pro-war. Honestly, I'm just getting tired of Bush crap, and don't want to vote in another conservative republican who will invade a country on a whim.

Obviously the economy's a huge issue, but the war we're in is costing ridiculous amounts of money and is getting next to nothing accomplished.

As you were probably able to derive, Obama is my choice due to his stance on war. Other things about him I would consider pluses are his stances on personal freedoms like abortion and drugs.

[The Colonel]

So... You actually agree with those "terrorist" labels? And it seems you like McCain because of his "tough on terrorist" attitude. This is exactly what America cannot afford to do. Despite some of the racist policies of the Europe, the world sees the E.U. as the better economic super power. Why? Because they don't use their military willy nilly. The United States has so many idle bases all around the world. And we had way too many military operations for the past 50 years. Some, like Bosnia, Kosovo and Somalia were for the good. But there were so many military operations that weren't necessary. America also needs a president who will cut military spending big time. And McCain is definitely not the person that would do this.

I agree with labeling terrorists as terrorists. Hezbollah, is a terrorist group. Timothy McVeigh was a terrorist. I like McCain, because along with having experience and not being a "NeoCon" and more of a Reagan-esque Republican, he has a "cut the bullshit" policy. The EU isn't an economic super power because of their military. The EU is an economic super power because they have several countries completely interconnected working towards a singular economy. Not because of war. Bosnia, Kosovo, Somalia yeah. What about Iraq? Saddam slaughtering non-Sunnis. We don't use ONE condition for doing everything. We don't need to cut military spending per se, we just need to change the way we spend it. We haven't upped the budget percentage wise in a long time. Temporary war-time budget increases are not actually part of the budget, but rather temporarily increased funds for the war.

[DHC]

As you were probably able to derive, Obama is my choice due to his stance on war. Other things about him I would consider pluses are his stances on personal freedoms like abortion and drugs.

obama has pledged to continue the war on drugs

just because theyre democrats, it doesnt mean they actually believe in social liberalism

[pickupstix60]

obama has pledged to continue the war on drugs

source?

I haven't been able to find all that much. A lot of the youtube videos are old, from like 2004, and I can't find anything on his main site.

[serial_]

... Look man. This guy is the only one who is actually willing to use something called diplomacy with nations like Iran, Syria, Cuba, Libya, and political parties like Hamas, Hizballah, ect. The "rogues" of the world. And wtf is this ignorant shit about Obama's experience?

Yes that's it! Let's TALK it out with the people that want to nuke us.

[Shwanzig]

Obama ftw. He's probably going to win the GE.

McCain wouldn't be so bad if he weren't so pro-war. Honestly, I'm just getting tired of Bush crap, and don't want to vote in another conservative republican who will invade a country on a whim.

Obviously the economy's a huge issue, but the war we're in is costing ridiculous amounts of money and is getting next to nothing accomplished.

As you were probably able to derive, Obama is my choice due to his stance on war. Other things about him I would consider pluses are his stances on personal freedoms like abortion and drugs.

LOL @ thinking George Bush is a Conservative. Christ look at government spending, it's through the roof.

[TheBase]

Yes that's it! Let's TALK it out with the people that want to nuke us.

That is one ignorant ass statement.

[TheBase]

LOL @ thinking George Bush is a Conservative. Christ look at government spending, it's through the roof.

He is a conservative. He is what you would call a neocon. You're thinking of a fiscal conservative. George Bush is definitely not a fiscal conservative. He's a neocon.

[TheBase]

perhaps its because youre not a taxpayer, but let me tell you - even those of us in the lowest bracket got a significant cut, and it helps a LOT.
income tax in the USA is PROGRESSIVE, btw... you must be thinking of payroll taxes like social security, medicare, etc.

It's not progressive enough. There is a cap at 33%. You can be making millions (or billions) and it would still be at 33%. The poor and the middle class pay too much compared to how much the rich pay. But don't take it from me. Just look at what Warren Buffet has to say. Yes, Bush did cut taxes for all of us. Unfortunately, I don't have this chart with me (I saw it in my government class), but the chart shows how the people making more than $150,000 got a much higher cut in taxes while the people in income brackets below that got some really shitty tax breaks. It was so marginal compared to the tax cuts for the wealthy. And I do pay taxes. I work a part time job. I'm not angry about the fact that 14% of my income goes to the government. I'm angry about how that 14% is spent.

[TubularLuggage]

Yes that's it! Let's TALK it out with the people that want to nuke us.

For your sake, I'm going to point out that all that "Iran is evil" stuff they've been talking about in the US is pure propaganda.
Iran isn't going to nuke anyone even if they do build nuclear weapons, which I doubt they would. If they tried to nuke anyone, they'd be wiped off the face of the earth.
Additionally, Iran is probably one of the most stable countries in the region right now. Aside from Israel, they're probably one of the most pro-West too.

Americans get scared because Iran dares to do things like have military exercises, which apparently no country that isn't a strong ally of the US is allowed to do.

[The Colonel]

He is a conservative. He is what you would call a neocon. You're thinking of a fiscal conservative. George Bush is definitely not a fiscal conservative. He's a neocon.

No, Bush is NOT a NeoConservative. NeoConservative meant "new conservatives", which was basically between the 60s and 80s when several Democrats and Liberals were coming to the Right side of the spectrum. Bush, being a conservative all his life, is not a neocon.

Also, you drastically exagerrate the "rich"'s tax cuts. The tax break was pretty much even except for the extreme upper class, who recieved a larger one. Which is bullshit, but Congress approved it, so you really can't bitch about it only being Bush.

[Muad'dib]

No, Bush is NOT a NeoConservative. NeoConservative meant "new conservatives", which was basically between the 60s and 80s when several Democrats and Liberals were coming to the Right side of the spectrum. Bush, being a conservative all his life, is not a neocon.

Also, you drastically exagerrate the "rich"'s tax cuts. The tax break was pretty much even except for the extreme upper class, who recieved a larger one. Which is bullshit, but Congress approved it, so you really can't bitch about it only being Bush.

Bush himself is not a neo-con. His spending is high. But, he surrounds himself with neo-cons, and neo-conservatism has more to do with just the economy. In fact, a hallmark of neo-conservatism is aggressive foreign policy and nationalistic assertiveness, which I think we can see clearly.

The tax cut has to go. We are in too deep of a deficit to continue this stupid policy of reducing revenue. Reducing spending would work great along with increased taxes, and I have a suggestion for where we start first : stop wasting money on impractical and unpopular wars.

[The Colonel]

Bush himself is not a neo-con. His spending is high. But, he surrounds himself with neo-cons, and neo-conservatism has more to do with just the economy. In fact, a hallmark of neo-conservatism is aggressive foreign policy and nationalistic assertiveness, which I think we can see clearly.

You mean the modern view of "neo-conservatism" but it is really not "neo-conservatism", and rather just played old conservative values. NeoCon doesn't really exist anymore, the new "NeoCon" is just a term thrown around for the current view of Bush and his administration.

[TheBase]

No, Bush is NOT a NeoConservative.

Yes he is. He definitely talks like a neocon, acts like a neocon, was heavily influenced by neocons and neocon think tanks. He's a neocon. How can you possibly say he's not a neocon?

[The Colonel]

Because he wasn't a democrat or a liberal that switched over to conservatism. That is the definition of a neo-con, new conservative, it was embodied mainly during the Cold War when several Dems moved to the Right. Bush, being a life-long conservative, is NOT a neocon.

The term NeoCon is thrown around too loosely, it barely exists, it is more New Liberalism now.

[TheBase]

Also, you drastically exagerrate the "rich"'s tax cuts. The tax break was pretty much even except for the extreme upper class, who recieved a larger one. Which is bullshit, but Congress approved it, so you really can't bitch about it only being Bush.

No, I did not drastically exaggerate the tax cuts for the rich. And yes, I already know that congress has become increasingly irresponsible since the 1950s. Both Democrats and Republicans have been approving a lot of bull shit (i.e. the patriot act).

[TheBase]

Because he wasn't a democrat or a liberal that switched over to conservatism. That is the definition of a neo-con, new conservative, it was embodied mainly during the Cold War when several Dems moved to the Right. Bush, being a life-long conservative, is NOT a neocon.

The term NeoCon is thrown around too loosely, it barely exists, it is more New Liberalism now.

But the democrats of the old South really aren't any different from the "neocons" of today.

[The Colonel]

They aren't neocons. The "neocons" of today are not true NeoCons. The term NeoCon now is just saying "Guy A supports traditional conservative values" not "Guy A is a new conservative due to his changing views on liberalism".

Definition: "Neoconservatism was an intellectual movement of Cold War liberal Democrats and democratic socialists who moved rightward during the 1970s and 1980s."

[TheBase]

For your sake, I'm going to point out that all that "Iran is evil" stuff they've been talking about in the US is pure propaganda.
Iran isn't going to nuke anyone even if they do build nuclear weapons, which I doubt they would. If they tried to nuke anyone, they'd be wiped off the face of the earth.
Additionally, Iran is probably one of the most stable countries in the region right now. Aside from Israel, they're probably one of the most pro-West too.

Americans get scared because Iran dares to do things like have military exercises, which apparently no country that isn't a strong ally of the US is allowed to do.

I wouldn't go as far to say that Iran is pro-West. I would, however, say that Iran is more rational of an actor than the United States. But yeah, I know what you're trying to say. Iran is not a dangerous nation. Or at least not a direct threat to the U.S.